Ogłoszenie

Dear Friends,

It is with a heavy heart that we have decided to retire our beloved Forum Detroit. It has served the Polonia Detroit for over 10 years, and was a source of joy for many. However, after many months of inactivity, the time has come to bid it farewell.

Deepest and warmest thanks to all those who contributed to Forum discussions over the years, either by sharing their thoughts or reading those of others. Your presence and participation served as a building block of this online polish community.

Forum Detroit

#1 03.13.2013 13:15:38

Look761
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Zarejestrowany: 04.27.2008
Posty: 2856

Mamy nowego Papieża.

Papieżem został Jorge Bergoglio z Argentyny.
Za Wikipedią
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Bergoglio


"Czy świat bardzo się zmieni , gdy z młodych gniewnych wyrosną starzy , wkurwieni"
                                                                                                               
                                                                                                       Jonasz Kofta

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#2 03.13.2013 23:37:32

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Już się do niego dobierają wink
Ciekaw jestem opinii naszego polonijnego środowiska gejów, o ile mamy takie środowisko.
Yurek z pewnością będzie zadowolony.


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#3 03.13.2013 23:43:52

Zoomboy
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Od: USA
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Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

First Pope From The Jesuit Order Was Made A Cardinal By Pope John Paul II

Bergoglio is one of five children and as a child suffered a respiratory illness that left him with just one lung. Bergoglio is known in his native city’s archdiocese for his simplicity, CBS 2′s Schneider reported.

Prior to his election, Bergoglio didn’t live in the archbishop palace, but rather in an apartment, where he cooked his own meals. His vestments are also simple. Case in point, on Wednesday he came out in a white cassock instead of the red cape and papal stoll.

He even chose to wear his own, simple cross — devoid of diamond and jewels — as he stood on the balcony taking in the incredible scene below.

“He’s lived those 76 turbulent years on little buses and bikes and convents, in dusty lanes all across Latin America,” Small said. “I think he’s going to transform the papacy in a real way.”

Bergoglio often rode the bus to work and regularly visited the slums that ring Argentina’s capital. He considers social outreach, rather than doctrinal battles, to be the essential business of the Church.

“His way shows very much that he wants to approach people, listen to people, ask their blessing,” said the Rev. Luke Sweeney of the New York Archdiocese.

Czy będziemy mieli bale z powodu wybrania papieża?


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#4 03.14.2013 04:55:03

VIS wz.12
Rozgadany
Zarejestrowany: 02.21.2012
Posty: 305

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

""Bergoglio is one of five children and as a child suffered a respiratory illness that left him with just one lung."

Albo konkurs małych talentów pod hasłem: „Jedno Płuco, Dwie Ojczyzny”.

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#5 03.14.2013 09:21:11

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Niedługo będziemy mieli nasze małe "conclave", aczkolwiek główny stolec jest już przesądzony.
Jedyna szansą na jakiekolwiek zmiany jest abdykacja, ale czy to nastąpi?


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#6 03.14.2013 16:15:12

Look761
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Zarejestrowany: 04.27.2008
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Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.


"Czy świat bardzo się zmieni , gdy z młodych gniewnych wyrosną starzy , wkurwieni"
                                                                                                               
                                                                                                       Jonasz Kofta

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#7 03.18.2013 15:50:06

Look761
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Zarejestrowany: 04.27.2008
Posty: 2856

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.


"Czy świat bardzo się zmieni , gdy z młodych gniewnych wyrosną starzy , wkurwieni"
                                                                                                               
                                                                                                       Jonasz Kofta

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#8 03.18.2013 15:51:16

Look761
Niezaprzeczalna Legenda Forum
Zarejestrowany: 04.27.2008
Posty: 2856

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Bunt w Watykanie  ???


"Czy świat bardzo się zmieni , gdy z młodych gniewnych wyrosną starzy , wkurwieni"
                                                                                                               
                                                                                                       Jonasz Kofta

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#9 03.28.2013 19:40:48

nowy
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Zarejestrowany: 11.05.2009
Posty: 3860

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.


"Kto za młodu nie był buntownikiem, ten na starość będzie świnią"
                                                                            J.Piłsudski

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#10 06.24.2013 09:30:48

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Pope 'snub' of concert stuns cardinals, sends signal

(Reuters) - A last-minute no-show by Pope Francis at a concert where he was to have been the guest of honor has sent another clear signal that he is going to do things his way and does not like the Vatican high life.

Czy ta wiadomość dotrze do naszych kościołów?
Czy popisy wokalne księży, tance, balangi będą nadal kontynuowane w kościołach?


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#11 09.12.2013 15:29:16

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

A Franek miesza smile

Catholic priests may be allowed to marry amid Papal changes

Miejmy nadzieje, ze nie miedzy sobą lol
Chociaż z drugiej strony, cały majątek pozostałby w Kościele.

Pope Francis assures atheists: You don’t have to believe in God to go to heaven

Czyli dobre uczynki (good deeds) są ważniejsze niż wiara?

No to widzę paru samo-namaszczonych "prawdziwych katolików", którzy obejdą się smakiem lol
Na pokorę i pokutę nigdy nie jest za późno...


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#12 09.20.2013 20:37:24

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Pope Francis Is a Flaming Liberal

It’s not just homosexuality or birth control. He’s profoundly anti-conservative.
By William Saletan

The new head of the Catholic Church, Pope Francis, has given his first long interview. In three sessions with Father Antonio Spadaro, editor of the Jesuit publication La Civiltà Cattolica, Francis outlines his thinking on a series of issues, from poverty to homosexuality to women in the church. What does the interview tell us? It tells us the pope is a liberal. He’ll pull the church to the left, not just on sexuality, but on every issue that pits tradition against freedom or progress. Here’s a breakdown of the English translation of the interview, published by the Catholic journal America.

1. Reform. Spadaro tosses Francis a vague question about “Ignatian spirituality.” Francis uses this question as an opportunity to talk about spearheading change. “Many think that changes and reforms can take place in a short time,” he says. “I believe that we always need time to lay the foundations for real, effective change.” It’s not clear exactly what Francis is referring to. But evidently he’s been thinking about what needs to be changed and how to go about it.

2. Authoritarianism. Spadaro asks Francis how his experience as a Jesuit superior affected him. Francis tells him, “My authoritarian and quick manner of making decisions led me to have serious problems and to be accused of being ultraconservative.” The pope insists, “I have never been a right-winger. It was my authoritarian way of making decisions that created problems.” You can argue about the translation here, but no matter which term you use—ultraconservative, right-wing, authoritarian—it’s pretty obvious what kind of attitude Francis is rejecting.

3. Infallibility. Spadaro asks Francis what it means to “think with the church,” in the words of St. Ignatius. At this, Francis launches into a discussion of infallibility. “All the faithful, considered as a whole, are infallible in matters of belief,” he argues. “When the dialogue among the people and the bishops and the pope goes down this road and is genuine, then it is assisted by the Holy Spirit. … We should not even think, therefore, that ‘thinking with the church’ means only thinking with the hierarchy of the church.” Francis cautions that he’s not endorsing pure “populism.” But he’s manifestly rejecting the conventional understanding of infallibility. He interprets infallibility not as a present attribute—the rightness of what a pope or a college of cardinals decrees—but as a collective process. Together, through dialogue with the people, we get the right answer down the road. This notion of dynamic, collective infallibility presumes the fallibility of today’s popes and cardinals. 

4. Small-minded rules. Spadaro asks Francis whether the church needs reform. Francis replies, “The church sometimes has locked itself up in small things, in small-minded rules. The most important thing is the first proclamation: Jesus Christ has saved you.” Francis talks about mercy and love, conventional themes. But his slap at “small-minded rules” goes further. It signals that he doesn’t much like these rules at all. That’s a big shift from Pope Benedict.

5. The church’s opinion. At this point, Spadaro brings up the problem of people who are gay or remarried. He asks, “What kind of pastoral work can we do in these cases?” Far from ducking the topic, Francis plunges into it. “During the return flight from Rio de Janeiro I said that if a homosexual person is of good will and is in search of God, I am no one to judge,” Francis recalls. “By saying this, I said what the catechism says. Religion has the right to express its opinion in the service of the people, but God in creation has set us free: it is not possible to interfere spiritually in the life of a person.”
Francis’s reference to the catechism seems intended to reassure traditionalists that he’s not overthrowing the church’s teaching against gay sex. But in the next breath, he calls this the church’s “opinion.” You can question the translation, but if Francis had said something more like “truth,” surely the translation would reflect it. If this linguistic shift from judgment to opinion isn’t creeping subjectivism, it’s certainly creeping tolerance.

6. Son of the church. “We cannot insist only on issues related to abortion, gay marriage and the use of contraceptive methods,” Francis argues. “The teaching of the church,” he assures Spadaro, “is clear, and I am a son of the church, but it is not necessary to talk about these issues all the time.” In reactions to this passage, liberals have focused on the pope’s plea to talk less about the issues in question. But what’s far more intriguing is his flimsy pledge of allegiance: “I am a son of the church.” That’s not a defense of the doctrine, or even an endorsement of it. It’s pure acquiescence. It’s what you say when your heart isn’t in it.

7. Essentials. “The dogmatic and moral teachings of the church are not all equivalent,” Francis declares, still talking about hot-button issues. “The church’s pastoral ministry cannot be obsessed with the transmission of a disjointed multitude of doctrines to be imposed insistently. Proclamation in a missionary style focuses on the essentials, on the necessary things.” That’s a strong signal that he regards church teachings on these issues as non-essential, if not disjointed. He’s not renouncing the teachings. But he’s demoting them to a level at which they could later be modified or quietly abandoned.

8. Conservation vs. revelation. This is the most important part of the interview:

“The complaints of today about how ‘barbaric’ the world is—these complaints sometimes end up giving birth within the church to desires to establish order in the sense of pure conservation, as a defense. No: God is to be encountered in the world of today. God manifests himself in historical revelation, in history. … We must not focus on occupying the spaces where power is exercised, but rather on starting long-run historical processes.”

This is pretty abstract stuff, but it’s huge. Francis is rejecting the core principle of conservatism. He’s saying that God will be found not in the past but in the future, in the unfolding of history. To fulfill that history, you have to change the world. Francis is a progressive. He doesn’t assume that today’s Catholic teachings are eternally true. He assumes that the lesser, disjointed, non-essential teachings will evolve toward truth over time.

9. Humility. Spadaro asks the logical follow-up: “So if the encounter with God is not an ‘empirical eureka,’ and if it is a journey that sees with the eyes of history, then we can also make mistakes?” Yes, says Francis: “If one has the answers to all the questions, that is the proof that God is not with him. …  The great leaders of the people of God, like Moses, have always left room for doubt. You must leave room for the Lord, not for our certainties. We must be humble.” Francis assures Spadaro that this kind of humility “is not relativism if it is understood in the biblical sense, that God is always a surprise, so you never know where and how you will find him.” Doubt, humility, surprise—this may not be relativism, but it sure isn’t absolutism.

10. Doctrinal security. This is another crucial passage. Francis explains:

“If the Christian is a restorationist, a legalist, if he wants everything clear and safe, then he will find nothing. Tradition and memory of the past must help us to have the courage to open up new areas to God. Those who today always look for disciplinarian solutions, those who long for an exaggerated doctrinal ‘security,’ those who stubbornly try to recover a past that no longer exists­—they have a static and inward-directed view of things. In this way, faith becomes an ideology among other ideologies.”

Wow. Restoration, clarity, safety, tradition, stasis, disciplinarian solutions—it’s hard to imagine how any translation could obscure the anti-conservative thrust of Francis’s critique. The slam at “exaggerated doctrinal security” is particularly pointed. The era of Benedict is over. Faith, as Francis defines it, will transcend ideology. Teachings will change.

11. Developing dogma. Spadaro, according to his own paraphrase, asks Francis “about the enormous changes occurring in society.” Francis steers this question toward the need for doctrinal reform in the church. He reads Spadaro a passage from St. Vincent of Lerins: “Even the dogma of the Christian religion must follow these laws, consolidating over the years, developing over time, deepening with age.” Francis elaborates:

“Human self-understanding changes with time, and so also human consciousness deepens. Let us think of when slavery was accepted or the death penalty was allowed without any problem. So we grow in the understanding of the truth. Exegetes and theologians help the church to mature in her own judgment. Even the other sciences and their development help the church in its growth in understanding. There are ecclesiastical rules and precepts that were once effective, but now they have lost value or meaning.”

The pope’s meaning is clear: The church, like other institutions, makes mistakes. Four centuries ago, it was wrong about the cosmos. A century and a half ago, it was wrong about slavery. As science develops—about sexual orientation, for instance—will the church “grow in its understanding” and “mature in its judgment”? I can tell you how Francis would answer that question: God knows.

William Saletan's latest short takes on the news, via Twitter:
Tweets by @saletan


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#13 05.10.2014 10:43:29

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

POPE URGES 'LEGITIMATE REDISTRIBUTION' OF WEALTH

VATICAN CITY (AP) -- Pope Francis called Friday for governments to redistribute wealth and benefits to the poor in a new spirit of generosity to help curb the "economy of exclusion" that is taking hold today.

Francis made the appeal during a speech to U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon and the heads of major U.N. agencies who met in Rome this week.

Latin America's first pope has frequently lashed out at the injustices of capitalism and the global economic system. On Friday, Francis called for the United Nations to promote a "worldwide ethical mobilization" of solidarity with the poor.

He said a more equal form of economic progress can be had through "the legitimate redistribution of economic benefits by the state, as well as indispensable cooperation between the private sector and civil society."

Dlaczego nie zacznie od Watykanu?


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#14 07.13.2014 20:59:42

Zoomboy
Legendarny Mistrz Forum
Od: USA
Zarejestrowany: 07.09.2007
Posty: 13193

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

Pope Francis: 'About 2%' of Catholic clergy paedophiles

Pope Francis has been quoted as saying that reliable data indicates that "about 2%" of clergy in the Catholic Church are paedophiles.

The Pope said that abuse of children was like "leprosy" infecting the Church, according to the Italian La Repubblica newspaper.

He vowed to "confront it with the severity it demands".

But a Vatican spokesman said the quotes in the newspaper did not correspond to Pope Francis's exact words.

The BBC's David Willey in Rome says there is often a studied ambiguity in Pope Francis' off-the-cuff statements.

He wants to show a more compassionate attitude towards Church teaching than his predecessors, but this can sometimes cause consternation among his media advisers, our correspondent adds.

Pope says about two percent of priests are pedophiles: paper

ROME (Reuters) - About two percent of Roman Catholic clerics are sexual abusers, an Italian newspaper on Sunday quoted Pope Francis as saying, adding that the pontiff considered the crime "a leprosy in our house".

The article was a reconstruction of an hour-long conversation between the pope and the newspaper's founder, Eugenio Scalfari, an atheist who has written about several past encounters with the pope.

"Many of my collaborators who fight with me (against paedophilia) reassure me with reliable statistics that say that the level of paedophilia in the Church is at about two percent," Francis was quoted as saying.

"This data should hearten me but I have to tell you that it does not hearten me at all. In fact, I think that it is very grave," he was quoted as saying.

The pope was quoted as saying that, while most paedophilia took place in family situations, "even we have this leprosy in our house".

According to Church statistics for 2012, the latest available, there are about 414,000 Roman Catholic priests in the world.

The Vatican issued a statement noting Scalfari's tradition of having long conversations with public figures without taking notes or taping them, and then reconstructing them from memory. Scalfari, 90, is one of Italy's best known journalists.

While acknowledging that the conversation had taken place, Vatican spokesman Father Federico Lombardi issued a statement saying that not all the phrases could be attributed "with certainty" to the pope.

Lombardi said that, in particular, a quote attributed to the pope saying cardinals were among the sex abusers was not accurate and accused the paper of trying to "manipulate naive readers".

Last week, the Argentine pope held his first meeting with victims of sexual abuse by priests.

He told them the Church should "weep and make reparation" for crimes that he said had taken on the dimensions of a sacrilegious cult. He vowed zero tolerance for abusers and said bishops would be held accountable if they covered up crimes by priests in their diocese.

(Reporting By Philip Pullella; Editing by Rosalind Russell)

Pope promises 'solutions' to priestly celibacy

Vatican City (AFP) - Pope Francis promised "solutions" to the issue of priestly celibacy in an interview on Sunday that raised the possibility the Catholic Church could eventually lift the interdiction on married priests.

Speaking to Italy's La Repubblica daily, Francis also condemned child sex abuse as a "leprosy" in the Church and cited his aides as saying that "the level of paedophilia in the Church is at two percent".

"That two percent includes priests and even bishops and cardinals," he said.

Asked whether priests might one day be allowed to marry, Francis pointed out that celibacy was instituted "900 years after Our Lord's death" and that clerics can marry in some Eastern Churches under Vatican tutelage.

"There definitely is a problem but it is not a major one. This needs time but there are solutions and I will find them," Francis said, without giving further details.

The interview was the third in a series with the 90-year-old founder of the La Repubblica daily, Eugenio Scalfari, a famous journalist and known atheist.


That’s all, folks
Przekażmy sobie znak pokoju.
Hasta la vista, Vaya con Dios
Я возвращусь, Ich werde zurück sein, Je reviendrai, Estarei de volta, Θα είμαι πίσω, I červnu se zpět, Leszek vissza, وحقوق عودة

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#15 07.28.2014 15:23:11

madmax
Niezaprzeczalna Legenda Forum
Zarejestrowany: 03.09.2007
Posty: 4409

Re: Mamy nowego Papieża.

To dla naszych lokalnych wszystkowiedzacych smile



Dwa dni po wizycie w Casercie papież Franciszek ponownie przybył do tego włoskiego miasta, aby spotkać się z tamtejszą wspólnotą zielonoświątkowców. Jej pastorem jest jego przyjaciel, Giovanni Traettino.

Od początku lat 90. XX. jest on w zaangażowany w dialog ekumeniczny z katolickimi charyzmatykami. Brał on udział m.in. w czerwcowym spotkaniu papieża z Odnową w Duchu Świętym na Stadionie Olimpijskim w Rzymie. Obaj duchowni poznali się w 2006 r. w Buenos Aires.

Papież przyleciał helikopterem na lądowisko przy Pałacu Królewskim, skąd najpierw udał się do domu pastora. Po spotkaniu z nim i jego rodziną, pojechał samochodem do niedokończonego jeszcze kościoła Pojednania. Czekało tam na niego około 350 osób, głównie chrześcijan ewangelikalnych, przybyłych nie tylko z Włoch, ale także z USA, Argentyny, Kanady, Hiszpanii, Francji i Indii. Trzymając w jednej ręce swą czarną torbę, drugą pozdrawiał ludzi machających do niego z okolicznych balkonów.

Wyrażając radość z przybycia Franciszka, którego powitano w świątyni oklaskami, pastor Traettino poprosił zebranych o "jeszcze większy aplauz dla Jezusa". Odmówiono wspólnie modlitwę "Ojcze nasz".

W improwizowanym przemówieniu Franciszek przyznał, że niektórzy dziwią się, iż "papież przyjechał spotkać się z ewangelikami". - Przyjechałem, by spotkać się z braćmi - stwierdził Ojciec Święty. Wyznał, że papież może mieć pokusę, by powiedzieć: "ja jestem Kościołem, wy jesteście sektą". Dodał, że "wśród tych, którzy prześladowali i potępiali zielonoświątkowców" byli także katolicy. - Jestem pasterzem katolików i proszę was o przebaczenie za tych braci i siostry, którzy [tego] nie rozumieli albo byli skuszeni przez diabła - powiedział papież.

Wskazał, że "Jezus modlił się o jedność. Duch Święty sprawia różnorodność w Kościele. To On ją sprawia. Ale ten sam Duch Święty sprawia jedność i Kościół jest jeden w różnorodności. Różnorodność [jest] pojednana przez Ducha Świętego - tłumaczył papież.

Podkreślił "przykazanie dane przez Jezusa swemu ludowi: aby byli jedno". Wskazał przy tym na konieczność kroczenia w obecności Boga, gdyż to właśnie Jego obecność sprawia braterstwo między nami. - Zatrzymujemy się, patrzymy na siebie nawzajem i widzimy, że jesteśmy do siebie dość podobni - mówił Franciszek.

Wezwał zielonoświątkowców, by szanowali "różnorodność charyzmatów i harmonię charyzmatów", gdyż to Duch Święty "jest harmonią, która sprawia tę różnorodność".

Była to pierwsza w historii podróż papieża poza Rzym wyłącznie w tym celu, aby spotkać się z protestantami.


http://m.deon.pl/religia/serwis-papiesk … zenie.html


"Największą chlubą nie jest to, aby nigdy się nie potknąć, ale to, aby po każdym upadku dźwignąć się i stanąć na nogi."

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